04-05-2010, 11:25 AM
I can't think of anything that I don't like about this hobby. The things that upset me, I'd rather ignore than worry about them, the things that they don't make I either don't want or will build myself, or will do without. The people with whom I disagree I'll generally ignore, too, at least the areas wherein lies the disagreement. For the rest, we're here because of a common interest in trains of some kind, even those with whom we disagree politically or philosophically.
Very good point, Pete, and one of the reasons that I consider being called a "rivet counter" a compliment. No one has any business counting rivets on anybody's work but their own, and nobody should have much to say about folks who choose to not count rivets at all, either.
Good example, Kevin. We all have our own vision of what we want to model, be it a local line of which almost no one has ever heard, a fond remembrance from childhood, or a vast empire on a 4'x8'. The hobby is as personal as you wish to make it, the resources more available than they've ever been, and the know-how to get it all done is offered freely in forums such as this.
Possibly, but a "strict prototyper" may be one more interested in prototypical operations than in an accurate reproduction of the physical "plant", and, of course, everyone has to accept, to the degree with which they're personally comfortable, the limitations of time, available space, and their own capabilities.
There are many modellers who model no specific prototype but consider themselves "serious" modellers, and many whose skills equal or exceed those of many "prototypers".
I have to disagree with you on this one: I think that we're all fantasy modellers, with each version unique in some way to its creator. We borrow and share techniques and ideas, but use them in the fashion which best suits our particular vision.
If 100 people buy the same locomotive, some will see it in a similar way, and some others will see it in a different similar way, as there are always those who wish to "fit in". However, I think that the majority will see it in a way which fits into their own personal version of "outside the box thinking".
What is shown here in pictures is what each of us sees presented to us, but it's not necessarily what the presenter sees - interpretation is open to each individual, just as was the coffee cup.
I'd have to classify my own layout as a fantasy one: some prototypical aspects, some totally free-lanced (hopefully with some logic, although I'm not going to sweat any anomalies), a loose regard for geography and time, a few examples of "rivet counting" and just as many of a disregard for it. I've idealised a time before my own, with a prosperity and harmony where little actually existed, and a largely un-modelled populace with no need for political affiliation, racial differences, or socio-economic cares. My big business is generous and socially responsible, my unions reasonable and realistic. It never rains or snow, or gets too hot or cold. My steam engines never sully a line full of drying clothes, yet belch out enormous clouds of soot on demand of my demented mind.
No fantasy modellers, indeed! 
Oh, and those Thomas modellers? With Thomas serving as the prototype, Thomas aficionados are probably closer to a true representation of their chosen loco than any prototypers around.
Wayne
Sumpter250 Wrote:Rivet counting: This should always be a planning tool. It should never be a critiquing tool.
Very good point, Pete, and one of the reasons that I consider being called a "rivet counter" a compliment. No one has any business counting rivets on anybody's work but their own, and nobody should have much to say about folks who choose to not count rivets at all, either.
nachoman Wrote:The nostalgia comment reminded me of a personal experience... I once took a sketching class, and the instructor had an exercise where we were supposed to sketch a coffee cup. "Sketch it as you see it", he instructed. He placed the coffee cup in front of a camera, and displayed the image via a large screen so everyone in the classroom was seeing the same image of the coffee cup. Again, the exercise was to sketch what we saw on the screen.
After 5 minutes elapsed, he went around the room and selected students drawings as examples for the class. Some showed the coffee cup from an angle where one could see inside the rim, others where the inside of the cup could not be seen. Some had the handle on the left, some on the right, some had the shadows on the right, others on the left. But they were all instructed to draw the same image.
The point was that many people weren't drawing what they saw. They instead saw a coffee cup, and drew what a coffee cup is supposed to look like (from their memory). I wonder if nostalgia and model railroading is the same way. Instead of recreating what was there, we selectively (consciously or unconsciously) recreate what we think is supposed to be there. In some instances this is manifested as "modelers license". In others, it is "selective compression", a side effect of having a lack of layout space. But in other instances we are creating what we think a model layout ought to have - tunnels, high bridges, happy people playing in a park. But that is also the best part about this hobby - it is our layout and we can create what we want, or what we like.
Good example, Kevin. We all have our own vision of what we want to model, be it a local line of which almost no one has ever heard, a fond remembrance from childhood, or a vast empire on a 4'x8'. The hobby is as personal as you wish to make it, the resources more available than they've ever been, and the know-how to get it all done is offered freely in forums such as this.
MountainMan Wrote:I think that concept depends on what you think model railroading actually is. If you are a strict prototyper, then what you seek to do is create a museum-quality model of a specific place and time. If you are not, then you seek to model an operating railroad with the "feel" and "flavor" of a particular era, usually bending history to make it fit.
Possibly, but a "strict prototyper" may be one more interested in prototypical operations than in an accurate reproduction of the physical "plant", and, of course, everyone has to accept, to the degree with which they're personally comfortable, the limitations of time, available space, and their own capabilities.
There are many modellers who model no specific prototype but consider themselves "serious" modellers, and many whose skills equal or exceed those of many "prototypers".
MountainMan Wrote:What is interesting about this hobby is that it has no fantasy modelers, except those interested in Thomas The Train Engine, perhaps.
I have to disagree with you on this one: I think that we're all fantasy modellers, with each version unique in some way to its creator. We borrow and share techniques and ideas, but use them in the fashion which best suits our particular vision.
If 100 people buy the same locomotive, some will see it in a similar way, and some others will see it in a different similar way, as there are always those who wish to "fit in". However, I think that the majority will see it in a way which fits into their own personal version of "outside the box thinking".
What is shown here in pictures is what each of us sees presented to us, but it's not necessarily what the presenter sees - interpretation is open to each individual, just as was the coffee cup.
I'd have to classify my own layout as a fantasy one: some prototypical aspects, some totally free-lanced (hopefully with some logic, although I'm not going to sweat any anomalies), a loose regard for geography and time, a few examples of "rivet counting" and just as many of a disregard for it. I've idealised a time before my own, with a prosperity and harmony where little actually existed, and a largely un-modelled populace with no need for political affiliation, racial differences, or socio-economic cares. My big business is generous and socially responsible, my unions reasonable and realistic. It never rains or snow, or gets too hot or cold. My steam engines never sully a line full of drying clothes, yet belch out enormous clouds of soot on demand of my demented mind.
No fantasy modellers, indeed! Oh, and those Thomas modellers? With Thomas serving as the prototype, Thomas aficionados are probably closer to a true representation of their chosen loco than any prototypers around.
Wayne