Starting A GE 70 Tonner.

[Brakie]

I never knew they are several steps in starting a 70 tonner..

For those of us that likes to model a small short line or a industrial switching operation with a 70 tonner could allow a few seconds for the engineer to start the 70 tonner.

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Ed,Since the F&C used a 70 tonner maybe you could enlighten us by sharing any short cuts you guys may have used.

[FCIN]

Larry;

I found this video to be very interesting in so far as we never had to go though all of those steps to start ours. It looks to me like this is a procedure that you'd have to go through when the engine has been out of service for some time. All we ever did was to climb into the cab, open the electrical cabinet doors, throw the battery switch, hit the start button, and in a few minutes we were off and running.

Never saw the shop personnel go through all those procedures either, although they may have from time to time and I just wasn't around when they did it. The four 70 ton GE's we had in 1969, FCIN 100, 101 and 102 and MPB 20, all saw frequent use and we usually used two of them MU'd, especially to handle the tonnage to and from the distilleries. The shop crew took care of all the maintenance and kept them in excellent running order; unlike the Pinsly years when they were more concerned about keeping the engines clean than in running condition. The FCIN 70 tonners were all Phase I units, built in 1946 (100) and 1947 (101,102) and were still in top condition when they left the property in the early 1970's.

They were certainly easy to operate and quite powerful with their double reduction gearing. It was surprising just how much tonnage we could handle with them up the grade out of Frankfort. Rail fans tend to think that smaller locomotives equal less pulling power, but that really wasn't the case. The GE's were really nice to switch with, as they would accelerate quickly and were great on some of the tight curves inside the distilleries. Certainly a classic locomotive that revolutionized the short line railroad industry. I always liked the sound of those Cooper-Bessemer engines.

Here's a shot of my favorite No. 102, in the original pre-Pinsly era paint. Paint is showing its age some, but I always liked this scheme much more than the Pinsly scheme:    

[Brakie]

Ed,Thanks for your valuable insight..I thought that was a lot of work just to start a 70 tonner.

I suppose I should have thought twice since a museum was starting that 70 tonner.


I wish Bachmann would release a F&C 70 tonner or ALCO..It wouldn't take much for me to model the F&C since it was a Kentucky shortline and is feature in my favorite book "Ghost Railroads Of Kentucky" by Elmer Sulzer..

Another railroad I like from your area was the Morehead & Northfork.

[FCIN]

Larry;

Yep, that would have been a real hassle to go though every time you started one up! But was interesting. Here's a photo of one of the F&C GE 70 tonners that my friend made (he has models of all of them) and once again it's my favorite No. 102.     If you look closely, you'll see that he modified the Bachmann model to be a Phase I version by eliminating the front radiator opening, changing the headlights and a few other details to match the F&C engines. Even made his own decals for them. Compare it to the prototype photo.

In the background, you can just barely see his model of No. 100, in its as delivered paint with the short exhaust stack and simply lettered "F & C RR Co". Only thing wrong with the paint job is that the center area of the top of hoods should be black, but he's corrected that, including adding the missing horns; since I took my photos.

Probably the best you can expect from Bachmann, would be to get one in solid red and go from there. I know that people modeling various Pinsly railroads have approached Bachmann several times about doing the 70 tonners in various Pinsly schemes, but Bachmann feels like they wouldn't appeal to that many people. I think they'd score, if they produced the model in the Pinlsy scheme, but unlettered and provide decal sets for the various roads, they'd sell a lot of them!

He brought all of his F&C models over here one night to test run them, as he doesn't have a layout or even a test track and we were a bit disappointed with the performance. The DC only versions varied from very poor to okay in performance - most very noisy and stalled frequently. The one that was DCC equipped didn't want to run that great either but wasn't as noisy. But then they would probably run better if additional weight was added to them.

Modeling the F&C would be hard to do, other than to model just a particular area of the railroad, but there were so many features that you'd want to try and include, making that a tough decision. I know a couple of people that are trying to model the F&C, but their track plans have no resemblance to anything on the prototype. I had considered just modeling the Old Grand Dad Distillery as a switching layout, but then changed my mind and decided to just go freelance.

One of my favorite Kentucky short lines was the Flemingsburg & Northern. Of course it was gone by 1955, but it was a nice little operation that could be easily modeled. Just 6 miles long, one locomotive and a push-pull type operation to boot. I'm not into steam or that era, but I have considered something like the F&N a few times over the years.

[Brakie]

The one that was DCC equipped didn't want to run that great either but wasn't as noisy. But then they would probably run better if additional weight was added to them.
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Agreed..Mined ran smooth for a short time and started having a decoder hum.The engines proformance improved after I set the start voltage,speed step and momentum with my MRC Tech 6 in the DCC mode..

I like those F&C 70 Tonners and I noticed the cab of the 102.

Of the Distilleries was Grandads the largest?

[Mike Kieran]

Ed,

What railroad is the MPB?

[FCIN]

Of the Distilleries was Grandads the largest?

Larry;
The largest distillery served by the F&C was the George T. Stagg Distillery (Schenley) on the two mile spur out of Frankfort. There was a yard inside the distillery grounds that was actually larger than the Frankfort yard with a total of 3 miles of track in that one plant. Old Grand Dad was on a smaller scale, but had an interesting track arrangement. Both of them could be a challenge to switch since you had so many cars that had to be placed in the order the distilleries wanted them. Wasn't unusual to spend as long as 4 or 5 hours switching Schenley and 3 to 4 hours at Grand Dad.

Think I've posted this before, but here's a diagram I made up of the Old Grand Dad plant. Would make for a nice switching layout:    
Mike;
MPB was Pinsly's Montpelier & Barre Railroad.

[Sumpter250]

Ed, What railroad is the MPB?

Most likely suspect? http://www.blurb.com/bookstore/detail/372302

[Brakie]

Ed,Thanks! I might be getting a house after the first of the year and I' m already thinking about a much larger ISL or adding on to Slate Creek.


My railroader's eye tells me that Old Grand dad was a lot of switching.

[FCIN]

Most likely suspect? http://www.blurb.com/bookstore/detail/372302

Yep, that's the culprit.

In July 1961, the F&C got a contract to haul crushed rock from the quarry on their line in Paris to the site where Interstate Highway 75 was under construction about 1 mile east of Georgetown. To handle the additional traffic, Pinsly sent two M&B (MPB) GE 70 tonners (Nos. 20 and 21) along with a fleet of about 45 ex-B&M 55-ton capacity twin hoppers to handle the new service. About a month after the "Rock Train" service started, MPB 21 was sent to Pinsly's Greenville & Northern Railway (GRN) and Pinsly then sent MPB 22 to replace that one. Wasn't unusual for the Pinsly Company to shuffle locomotives from one short line to another.

The "Rock Train" service lasted only about 90 days because the limestone rock didn't meet specifications and after that, the hoppers were sold for scrap and MPB 22 wound up going to Pinsly's new St. Johnsbury & Lamoille County Railroad (SJLC). MPB 20 remained on the property until the 70 tonners were replaced by the heavier ALCo S-2 and S-4 locomotives in the early 1970's.

One interesting note; after Pinlsy began replacing all the GE's with ALCo's, they still sent another GE 70 tonner to Frankfort which was SJLC 51. It was relettered and numbered as F & C Railroad 105, but didn't remain on the property for very long. FCIN 105 wound up working for a scrap dealer in Chicago, IL.

[FCIN]

My railroader's eye tells me that Old Grand dad was a lot of switching.

It sure was! With limited room to work the tracks in the distillery, you had to have your train blocked out more or less in spotting order leaving Frankfort. If you didn't have your train blocked out that way, you could have easily find yourself in a real mess. But even with your cars blocked you'd still have to swap cars around as the distillery provided you with their own switch list showing were they wanted specific cars placed. Some of the cars we'd bring to the distillery would be held for loading/unloading the next trip and we'd have to add others that had been held on previous trips into the mix.

You'd have to move cars back and forth between the tracks to line up your spots and at the same time, line up your outbound cars and re-spots. Wasn't unusual to have hold of 15 or 20 cars while making your moves. Now and then, we'd be so short on working room, that we'd have to pick out as many of our outbound cars as we could and take them back to the main line and leave them so we'd have room to work.

All that doesn't even take into account that in the last years of operation, we had to separate all loaded cars with empties going to and from Frankfort, and often had to make two or three trips up the hill to get all the cars delivered. Talk about a headache!

Switching at Stagg (Schenley) wasn't as bad because you had plenty of room to line things up in the Stagg yard tracks, but there were a lot of long moves involved and very tight clearances inside the plant. Moving around the plant track to spot your coal and grain cars, the train just barely cleared the bottling house and was in a very tight curve. L&N "Big Blue" and similar sized 100-ton covered hoppers just cleared that building by inches.

Modeling the Old Grand Dad plant, even in a compressed form, would make for an interesting switching layout. About the only problem would be having structures on both the front and back of the layout, but then all of the buildings at Grand Dad were fairly low in height, with the exception of the still and powerhouse, which would be on the back side of the layout. Just stage your inbound train on the spur as though it was just arriving at the distillery and when finished go back to that position as though you were going back to the main line. There were plenty of trees on either side of the spur coming into the plant that would help to disguise the staging.