Intellibox II can program Tsunami sound decoder
#1
I got a Bochmann GP7 with "Value Sound". I understood that is technically a Tsunami sound decoder with some intentional limitations. I did also read about the unusual DCC programming requirements of Tsunami sound decoders.
To my surprise can my Uhlenbrock Intellibox II read and write all CVs on the programming track.
That might be of interest for the very few Germans/Europeans using an Intellibox with US Tsunami sound decoders

I have to add a nasty remark. It looks like changing CV1 might have some random side effects on other CVs. e.g. setting CV1 = 1 clears the low order bit of CV 29 (direction).
Reinhard
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#2
oh no, Reinhard has gone to the dark side, Sound in a loco! Icon_lol
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#3
torikoos Wrote:oh no, Reinhard has gone to the dark side, Sound in a loco! Icon_lol
You would not believe how much the volume is tuned down to satisfy my sensitive ears. The corresponding CV is set to 25 from 192 at arrival Confusedhock:
It is fun to operate the bell and the horn in a prototypical manner when switching industries street running with three intersections. Switching takes even more time now.
Reinhard
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#4
I do the same Reinhard, particularly at home, volume down for home use, at a club where the room is bigger, and more people are talking it goes up, but it just adds a fun dimension to operating a (switching layout). Use things (if available) like air let off on brakes, coupler clank, horn and bell (although that is also one item I usually turn right down as it too can become very irritating very quickly), and the rumble of an engine in the background.
If the decoder (the full versions of Tsunami do) have EQ settings, I usually turn the high frequencies right down, as they are the most piercing, and the small speakers tend to over emphasize these anyway.

Once you feel brave enough, try out a ESU decoder. Have it programmed by your dealer (so you don't have to buy their programmer for sound files) with the sound file you want, and you will have low speed running of a similar quality as a Zimo or Lenz decoder, without the tedious set up that is sometimes needed to get a Tsunami decoder to behave :-)

Koos

PS: If things get a little overbearing, press F8, and on most decoders this mutes the sounds all together for a bit of peace and tranquility :-)
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#5
torikoos Wrote:.... Once you feel brave enough, try out a ESU decoder. .... a similar quality as a Zimo or Lenz decoder,....
Koos, funny thing is I have a bunch of ESU sound decoders. I started my US model railroad with NYC and most of those black got the ESU sound installed. I did also get the ESU programmer and kept a small Windows laptop for programming. The sound decoders are still installed in most of my steam engines.
The problem with ESU decoders (with and without sound) is a nasty humming sound very annoying at low speed. Intensive negotiations with ESU ended fruitless, it works as designed. I had about 30 ESU (none sound) decoders replaced with Zimo decoders some years ago just to get rid of the humming sound. I wanted to be mean and bought a bunch of ESU for about 20€ to avoid Zimo for 30€. That was a bad and costly failure.
Anyhow, the ESU sound programming capabilities are endless and absolute top notch.
The Bachmann value sound Tsunami is limited in several ways (no break etc.) but it provides engine, bell and horn sound and handles the motor quite nice. Not as well as a Zimo but still at a satisfactory level and the surplus in price and function is well balanced.
It is a toy and I do not intend to install sound in many of my diesel engines. Another Bachmann RS3 with sound is on order. I intend to use the GP7 and RS3 sound chassis with "shell swapping" in multiple scenarios. e.g. my home made Corman GP7 would be a nice shell for the GP7 sound chassis too.

ps. It toke a while until I discovered Tsunami CV 66/95 (trim) as a functional equivalent to CV5 (top speed). It is nasty to hide such a basic function so deep in the CV jungle Wink
pps. I have also the basic Zimo programmer (no sound). Zimo had a time when firmware updates happened on a monthly base and some of them were really required.
Reinhard
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#6
Agreed, the ESU motor control does humm/whine , that's their only drawback indeed. Which version decoders do you have? V3.5 or V4's (including the Select and select direct) ? the soundfiles that 'fit' in a V4 family decoder are able to be loads better than the older V3.5 ones.

I have just managed to get a donation of 3 or 4 QSI decoders, which are in the mail to me. QSI are incredibly complex to set up, their sound is not great (except for the Horn which is great), but motor control is very good.
As they were free, I'm going to use them as an intermediate step to equip some of my loco's that have, until now, no DCC decoders and couldn't be used.

Koos
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#7
It was V3.5 at that time. I got a V4 none sound later to check the humming sound but it did not improve.
Zimo sound would be a real alternative as I am absolutely satisfied with Zimo's motor handling. But it is not worth the time and money for me. Two Bachmann "low cost sound" engines is about the level of sound I need.
A perfect Atlas engine (e.g. GP40) controlled by an Zimo decoder gliding silently over the rails is candy to my ears Thumbsup
Reinhard
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#8
faraway Wrote:It was V3.5 at that time. I got a V4 none sound later to check the humming sound but it did not improve.
Zimo sound would be a real alternative as I am absolutely satisfied with Zimo's motor handling. But it is not worth the time and money for me. Two Bachmann "low cost sound" engines is about the level of sound I need.
A perfect Atlas engine (e.g. GP40) controlled by an Zimo decoder gliding silently over the rails is candy to my ears Thumbsup

I agree, with you Reinhard, ESU didn't change the design (at all) much as far as the motor drive was concerned. It is a bit noisy, but it is very effective, I wonder if it's the price to pay for not getting any heat developing, some decoders do get warmer than others.

In any case, your vision of an Atlas GP40 gliding silently is also very appealing.

Koos
Be sure to visit my model railroad blog at <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.namrr.blogspot.com">http://www.namrr.blogspot.com</a><!-- m -->
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#9
torikoos Wrote:... , ESU didn't change the design (at all) much as far as the motor drive was concerned.
Of course they changed the motor drive mangement in their V4.0. To the worse side.
Before the arrival of the V4.0 i was a fully satisfied ESU customer. Dozen of the Lopi Basic V1.0 and of the V3.0 were mounted and with some adjusting of the PID parameters the so equipped locos were moving without humming sounds.
Until the V4.0 arrived. The real bugbear is the poor motor management compared to it's precedessor V3.0.
Humming is one of the least problems. The motor drive seemed me optimized for those antique drivetrains like Märklin split field or Fleischmann or Lima pancakes or else pre war designs. There are so low frequencies in the motor drive, especially when the option of adaptible frequencies is on, just right to kill coreless coil motors.
No Sir this decoder ist not a step forward into the future, it is complex, it is more complicated than a Zimo, but has not the benefits of an Zimo.

A Zimo decoder is a nerd decoder, made by nerds for nerds.
This V4.0 is only complex, complicated and user unfriendly.

Lutz
Cheers Lutz
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#10
Reinhard, It's nice to see you admit that sound dose make a difference switching the cars!!! To be honest it's hard for me to run the loco's with out sound now!!!!! Thumbsup
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#11
Schraddel Wrote:
torikoos Wrote:... , ESU didn't change the design (at all) much as far as the motor drive was concerned.
Of course they changed the motor drive mangement in their V4.0. To the worse side.
Before the arrival of the V4.0 i was a fully satisfied ESU customer. Dozen of the Lopi Basic V1.0 and of the V3.0 were mounted and with some adjusting of the PID parameters the so equipped locos were moving without humming sounds.
Until the V4.0 arrived. The real bugbear is the poor motor management compared to it's precedessor V3.0.
Humming is one of the least problems. The motor drive seemed me optimized for those antique drivetrains like Märklin split field or Fleischmann or Lima pancakes or else pre war designs. There are so low frequencies in the motor drive, especially when the option of adaptible frequencies is on, just right to kill coreless coil motors.
No Sir this decoder ist not a step forward into the future, it is complex, it is more complicated than a Zimo, but has not the benefits of an Zimo.

A Zimo decoder is a nerd decoder, made by nerds for nerds.
This V4.0 is only complex, complicated and user unfriendly.

Lutz

Hi Lutz, I have to be honest, I am not familiar with the early ESU decoders that you mention, I only have a 3.5 and several v4 decoders. I therefore cannot judge how the earlier ones worked/sounded.
Tsunami's are less noisy, they do make some noise, but are much quieter, however I prefer ESU due to their relative easy set up (particularly the auto tune function I find very useful) compared to Tsunami's, or QSI's. T

Cheers, Koos
Be sure to visit my model railroad blog at <!-- m --><a class="postlink" href="http://www.namrr.blogspot.com">http://www.namrr.blogspot.com</a><!-- m -->
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#12
Just a remark about ESU decoder motor handling. I installed a modern LokPilot 4.0 (with 21 pin connector) an hour ago (Rapido GMD-1). A firmware update has been applied too.
It is still humming.....
Reinhard
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#13
Hi,

you should disable the adaptive motor control. If set, at low speed step it switches to low frequency motor pwm.
It improves only a little the low speed control.
...
Greetings Hardy
...
GULF MOBILE & OHIO and FRISCO and also ILLINOIS CENTRAL (Gulf)
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#14
GMO-Frisco Wrote:....disable the adaptive motor control...
It is set by default to fixed frequency (CV124, Bit4). It's an ESU, it needs that humming sound to be happy. I call it the audible vendor identification Wink

ps. Do not wonder if you don't hear the humming as I do. My hearing capabilities are far above average and do not match my age at all.
Reinhard
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#15
faraway Wrote:
GMO-Frisco Wrote:....disable the adaptive motor control...
It is set by default to fixed frequency (CV124, Bit4). It's an ESU, it needs that humming sound to be happy. I call it the audible vendor identification Wink

ps. Do not wonder if you don't hear the humming as I do. My hearing capabilities are far above average and do not match my age at all.
The only other things you can do is
CV49:
Bit 1 ist ON? (40kHz pwm)
Bit 4 is OFF? (may help, but no guarantee)

Disable CV 51 and CV 52, programm "0" for both CVs

Good luck.

Lutz

N.B. as a certain note of piquancy, the new ESU products have no NMRA conformity anymore...
Cheers Lutz
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